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Kindle swindle ?

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Offline daisyduck1976 Reading Industrial Magic by Kelley Armstrong
05 Nov 2010, 07:52 PM | Post: #11

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

Very good. Got to love a name with a good acronym!


Just letting everyone know that I have now made some additions to the FB group:

*list of all the publishers that are, or intend to start, fixing their own eBook prices

*advice for those that wish to leave one star reviews in protest of the price-fixing (I'm not actively promoting this as the focus of the group, just making a suggestion to those that wish to do it- I haven't left any myself as yet. I'm on the fence.)

Feel free to join. We now have more than 60 members.
**Totally Kindle-addicted and proud**
**Join the FB group against publisher-fixed eBook prices here: http://en-gb.facebook.com... **
Offline daisyduck1976 Reading Industrial Magic by Kelley Armstrong
07 Nov 2010, 01:08 PM | Post: #12

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

Another update. We have added-

*how to contact your MP and your MEP
*link to the website lostbooksales.com

We're now up to 90 members. Feel free to join.
**Totally Kindle-addicted and proud**
**Join the FB group against publisher-fixed eBook prices here: http://en-gb.facebook.com... **
Offline copenhagen Reading Der nye chinesisre Saadespil
07 Nov 2010, 04:13 PM | Post: #13

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

I am no fan of FB (for reasons not relevant), and am extremely disappointed that the discussion has been removed to there thus cutting me - and, no doubt, others - from further participation in this discussion.

It is no doubt laudable that you are including other e-book readers, but I could have sworn you described yourself as a' Kindler' in a group called Kindle Users Forum on a thread started and entitled Kindle swindle.

It seems a shame you didn't leave it here...
Offline Jaxom Reading 33AD, The Time Hunters and Immortal
07 Nov 2010, 04:33 PM | Post: #14

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

@ Copenhagen.
This discussion is in a number of places at the same time not just FB.
The topic is ripe for discussion here too. All we have to do as Kindlers is post comment in this thread. I do believe that the topic started on Amazon's Kindle discusion boards and not here.

@ Daisy Duck.
Could you do a cut and paste of the info from Face Book to here please?
I am sure KUF members who don't go onto FB would like to support your work to stop Publishers ripping off Kindle owners.
Offline licenced Reading Apocalypse Troll (David Weber)
07 Nov 2010, 06:14 PM | Post: #15

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

Indeed, there's another thread here discussing it, and the original Amazon thread is still trundling on and on - http://www.amazon.co.uk...

Dave
Offline daisyduck1976 Reading Industrial Magic by Kelley Armstrong
09 Nov 2010, 09:57 PM | Post: #16

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

This post was last modified: 09 Nov 2010 10:07 PM by daisyduck1976.
I am indeed a Kindler. I changed the name of the group at the suggestion of other posters on various forums so that any eReader owners would feel welcome. This is their issue as well as ours. The discussion hasn't really been moved to Facebook at all. I'm sorry if you feel that way. There is nothing being discussed there that isn't being discussed here and at kinfinity and the amazon forums. In fact we are not really discussing at all on FB, just posting updates of any responses we have had. The real discussions are being had on the various forums. The FB group is just a place where I have set up a lot of contact information in one place; easier than keeping a thread going without the thread being sidetracked by other issues as they often are. I set up the group at the request of posters on the Amazon forums and there is a thread there that I update on now and again. It was my intention to do that here, as I did in a post further up on this very thread.

The advantage of a Facebook group is the fact that if reported in the press or quoted to any other body/organistaion, they can say an FB group of x number of people... blah blah blah are against this policy. Although you don't like FB and I'm not suggesting that you join, a lot of people do and this is one of the benefits of social networking sites.

If it's any consolation, I was also asked to do it on Twitter, but I haven't! Twitter is beyond my understanding Wink

Anyway an update:

Now 116 members. Some people have now had responses from their MPs saying that they are looking into the matter, so that's positive. The OFT are definitely investigating, also good. I would still encourage people to contact the OFT so that they have a clear picture of how many people are concerned about the agency model.

Useful contact info to follow in my next post.
**Totally Kindle-addicted and proud**
**Join the FB group against publisher-fixed eBook prices here: http://en-gb.facebook.com... **
Offline daisyduck1976 Reading Industrial Magic by Kelley Armstrong
09 Nov 2010, 10:05 PM | Post: #17

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

Contact info for protesting the agency price model:

http://www.writetothem.com/

This gives you contact details for your MP and MEP. When you write be sure to include your address at the bottom as they are only allowed to investigate matters raised by their own constituents and they will just email you back to check your address of you don't.


Email address for contacting the EU:
InfoComp@ec.europa.eu

Email address for the OFT:
enquiries@oft.gsi.gov.uk

Email address for which? consumer group (will probably go down better if you are a Which member but I have emailed them anyway):
which@which.co.uk

Happy emailing- the more they receive, the better I would think.
**Totally Kindle-addicted and proud**
**Join the FB group against publisher-fixed eBook prices here: http://en-gb.facebook.com... **
Offline jacom700 Reading
11 Nov 2010, 09:13 AM | Post: #18

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

I also contacted the OFT and have posted their reply below in case anyone is interested.


"Your concerns regarding UK publishers requiring booksellers to adopt an ‘agent model’ for selling e-books
I refer to the concerns which you raised with the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) in your email of 4 November relating to the above matter.
The OFT is currently considering the issues raised by UK publishers under our powers and in accordance with our prioritisation principles, a copy of which can be found on our website. The OFT will write to you again with our conclusions in due course.
Yours sincerely
Matt Lacovara
Enquiries and Reporting Centre
Office of Fair Trading"
Offline daisyduck1976 Reading Industrial Magic by Kelley Armstrong
17 Nov 2010, 07:21 PM | Post: #19

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

An update as promised. It is clear that the OFT are investigating but I would still say contact them if you haven't yet, because the more complaints the better. Many people are now getting positive responses from MPs and MEPs, saying that they are concerned and are now looking into the matter. Most MPs seem to be referring a query on to the Business Secretary, Vince Cable. The responses I have personally received are below:

My MP (not great but he is new! At least some other people's MPs have been a bit more proactive):

Dear Miss xxxxxxxxxx,
Thank you for taking the time to write to me about price fixing on ebooks.
I share your concern and I am in agreement that this price fixing should not be standard practice.
As a proponent of sound economics and the free market, I believe that goods and services should enter the market and find their price through supply and demand. I regularly purchase books from Amazon as more often than not they have very competitive prices. Ebooks are no different from any other product; therefore they should not hide behind anti-competitive practices.
I would be interested to know the outcome of your letter to the Office of Fair Trading.
Once again, thank you for contacting me.

Yours sincerely,
Steve Baker MP

And much more hopeful from my MEP:

Dear Ms xxxxxxxxxx,
Thank you for contacting Catherine regarding the price fixing of eBooks. Catherine has asked me to look into this and I hope you don't remind me responding on her behalf.
I have been in contact with a representative of Amazon Kindle to discuss this. She directed me to this blog for their official response. http://www.amazon.co.uk...
I have also been informed that Penguin and Harper Collins have also placed Amazon in a position where they had to accept their terms in the way you refer to with Hachette.
We will be looking into this further and I would be happy to let you know of any developments. You may also find it useful to contact the Citizens Signpost Service. This is a team of independent legal experts providing free and personalised advice on your rights in the EU - in your own language and within a week of your request. Unfortunately, they only accept requests from the citizens concerned and will not give an answer to MEPs.
You can contact them and find out more information at http://ec.europa.eu... They should be able to clarify the legal position at a European level.
Thank you once again for contacting Catherine, I hope this response has been of use to you.
Yours sincerely,

Mark Wheeler

I will be contacting the citizens rights people that he mentioned and I think it's good news that he is continuing to look into the
**Totally Kindle-addicted and proud**
**Join the FB group against publisher-fixed eBook prices here: http://en-gb.facebook.com... **
Offline daisyduck1976 Reading Industrial Magic by Kelley Armstrong
22 Nov 2010, 06:19 PM | Post: #20

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RE: Kindle swindle ?

Exciting update!

Hi all,

Good news from my enquiry to Europe advice. Looks like they believe it to be illegal and they suggest an email address in order to complain about it. See below:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Sir/Madam,

Please find below the reply to your enquiry. Please note that the advice given by Your Europe Advice is an independent advice and cannot be considered to be the opinion of the European Commission, of any other EU institution or its staff nor will this advice be binding upon the European Commission, any other EU or national institution.

Dear Miss Jackman,
Thank you for your enquiry.
Whilst it remains a commercial decision for any company to decide at what price to sell its product to consumers, this decision must not be made in breach of the EU and UK rules on economic competition.
As you correctly point out, price-fixing is considered a hard-core violation of the competition rules.
In particular, in the field of retail distribution, resale price maintenance (RPM) is prohibited (and does not enjoy the exemption under Article 4 of the Block Exemption Regulation on Vertical Agreements (No 2790/1999). It is to be noted that the net book agreement was considered a form of RPM and as such contrary to competition law.
You can find out more about competition law from this official EU guide: http://ec.europa.eu...
You will find further explanation of the EU competition rules on this website: http://ec.europa.eu...
From the information you have provided us, it does appear that the model agency agreement (whereby book publishers have jointly agreed to fix the price at which books may be made available in electronic format) is in breach of competition law.
We understand that investigations have already begun in some US states including Connecticut and Texas to determine if the model agency agreement breaches US antitrust rules.
If you believe you have been the victim of price-fixing, you are free to contact the EU competition authorities by submitting a complaint to the European Commission's Competition DG. Their details are as follows:
European Commission
Directorate-General for Competition
B-1049 Brussels, Belgium
Tel. (32-2) 29-91111
Fax: (32-2)29-50128
e-mail: infocomp@ec.europa.eu
You may also address a complaint to the Office of Free Trading in the UK: http://www.oft.gov.uk...
We hope this answers your query.
We remain at your disposal, should you require further information.

To submit another enquiry, please visit Your Europe Advice, but do not reply to this e-mail.

Yours sincerely,

Your Europe Advice
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wonder if I need to buy a price-fixed book in order to be a victim. If so, I will, and then I will email the address given to complain about it.
Happy days Thumbs Up

Please do email: infocomp@ec.europa.eu
Groovy
**Totally Kindle-addicted and proud**
**Join the FB group against publisher-fixed eBook prices here: http://en-gb.facebook.com... **

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